Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

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Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby mm9 » Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:50 pm

I just sent this out to local bike shops and wanted to post here. Any thoughts or comments would be welcome.

All:

I'm a local cyclist and have a concern. I wanted to reach out to those of you in the local cycling community that may lead a Sunday group ride through parts of Cherokee County and/or North Fulton. This past Sunday (Father's Day), there was a large group of cyclists, 25 - 30+, riding in a pack going north on hwy 372 (Ballground Hwy) between Hwy 20 and Hwy 369. It was sometime between 9:45am and 10:30am. I was out on a motorcycle ride with another rider. We came up on a slow moving traffic jam of approximately 6 - 8 cars/trucks traveling north on 372, behind the pack of cyclists. The concerning part is that the riders were riding all the way across the lane, 3 - 5 riders across in some places. Cars could not reasonably pass. This went on for a while. The cars/trucks following were getting visibly frustrated. I found a few safe places to pass on my motorcycle (thin profile and great acceleration) and worked my way up to the lead rider. I tried to use courtesy and told him that I was a cyclist myself and informed him that he had a group of cars behind him getting angry and that his group was not "singling up" He replied that they could ride in twos if they wanted. I told him that his group was riding as thick as 3 - 5. He told me he would pass word back to slim down the group. My buddy in the back on his motorcycle never passed everyone. He stayed behind the traffic jam and the cycling pack. I drove ahead and waited at our next turn which was 369. He took a good while to get back to me. He said those cyclists never thinned their pace lines but stayed in one big wide group. My riding friend was very angry at their lack of courtesy. He said "no wonder some people get so ticked off that they lose it and swerve towards cyclists"

We all have friends or know of folks who have lost their lives or have been seriously injured from car/truck drivers while on their bicycles. Up to 1 out of 8 or so drivers of vehicles are dealing with some clinical emotional issues. When a group of cyclists act rude in an area, this sometimes pushes those with emotional issues over the line. They sometimes take it out on some poor cyclist in the future.

I just wanted to reach out to you folks to see if this could have been any of your rides, and/or to possibly ask you to re-emphasize good group riding etiquette to your ride leaders. Courteous group riding will go a long way to helping minimize dangerous angry car/truck drivers in our area.

Thanks for your consideration.

Sincerely,
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby trhoppe » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:00 pm

Because a bunch of retard drivers (not you in particular, but 50% of the people are below average intelligence, so think about how stupid they are) are going to safely pass 30 cyclists on a 2 lane road even if they are going 2 wide.

:roll:

Cyclists are allowed to take up the lane if they don't feel safe. I do it all the time.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby Mark D. » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:38 pm

trhoppe wrote:Because a bunch of retard drivers (not you in particular, but 50% of the people are below average intelligence, so think about how stupid they are) are going to safely pass 30 cyclists on a 2 lane road even if they are going 2 wide.

:roll:

Cyclists are allowed to take up the lane if they don't feel safe. I do it all the time.


2 wide is the law. To justify stupidity with stupidity is just stupid. No where does it say that cyclist can ride 4-5 abreast if they 'dont feel safe.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby SkidSteer » Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:04 pm

I don't know of a group that rides that stretch of road on Sunday morning, 372 isn't a good route either so I'm surprised anyone would take a large group up there. Nonetheless, a group that refuses to tighten up when cars are back would raise my blood pressure too. It's typically one or two idiots that refuse to line up that makes the whole group look bad. Ironically enough, these are probably the same folks that cause road rage while driving in their cars.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby grog » Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:06 am

mm9 - well said, thanks for the post . . .

trhoppe, while Mark was rather direct, his point stands that, essentially, 2 wrongs don't make a right. Just like there are times to use common sense when riding a posted "Open" trail after a heavy rain, common sense should stand that despite legally being allowed to ride 2 wide or take a lane when feeling unsafe, there are times when the line should stream out. And while it's been a while since I've been on that road and could be completely wrong, the vast majority of it I seem to remember being "safe" to ride on without taking the lane. Point is - yes, I've taken the lane, usually on blind curves where I don't want someone trying to pass me only to find themselves facing an oncoming car. I can't think of a time I've done it on a straightaway which the majority of that road is (again, if I remember right).

I'm going to get flamed for this but in the interest of full disclosure, I wasn't overly keen on the 3 foot law - at least not in addition to the current 2 abreast law. Honest feeling is that it should be one or the other but not both. Get 2 abreast then add the 3 foot and that's the whole lane . . . just my opinion, though.

I respect your opinion, just disagree with it. The reality is that I abhor these debates - especially amongst ourselves - as they do nothing but give the anti-biker crowd more fodder to rally behind. Are they going to look at my post and say "wow - what a reasonable response?" or your's and say "see? those damn bikers are selfish and only think about their own kind"?
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby u1ockjustice » Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:56 am

grog wrote:mm9 - well said, thanks for the post . . .

trhoppe, while Mark was rather direct, his point stands that, essentially, 2 wrongs don't make a right. Just like there are times to use common sense when riding a posted "Open" trail after a heavy rain, common sense should stand that despite legally being allowed to ride 2 wide or take a lane when feeling unsafe, there are times when the line should stream out. And while it's been a while since I've been on that road and could be completely wrong, the vast majority of it I seem to remember being "safe" to ride on without taking the lane. Point is - yes, I've taken the lane, usually on blind curves where I don't want someone trying to pass me only to find themselves facing an oncoming car. I can't think of a time I've done it on a straightaway which the majority of that road is (again, if I remember right).

I'm going to get flamed for this but in the interest of full disclosure, I wasn't overly keen on the 3 foot law - at least not in addition to the current 2 abreast law. Honest feeling is that it should be one or the other but not both. Get 2 abreast then add the 3 foot and that's the whole lane . . . just my opinion, though.

I respect your opinion, just disagree with it. The reality is that I abhor these debates - especially amongst ourselves - as they do nothing but give the anti-biker crowd more fodder to rally behind. Are they going to look at my post and say "wow - what a reasonable response?" or your's and say "see? those damn bikers are selfish and only think about their own kind"?


if it makes you feel better, i don't think very many people at all see any of the posts on this forum.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby LoneStar » Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:45 am

Ugh is all I can say. Cyclists can be our own worst enemies sometimes.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby mm9 » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:01 am

Thanks for giving some comments. BTW - I don't think it was just blocking the lane for safety, like at the crest of a hill. There were many stretches they could have singled or at least doubled up and let cars pass. I watched for a while because I was a little in disbelief. BTW - this group looked like an "A" type group - very fit cyclists that should have known better.

My motorcycle riding buddy is not a road cyclist. He was fighting mad when we met back up that he wanted to go "catch those SOB's and let them know what *** they were being. I'd like to kick a few of them off their bicycles! That was rude, stupid and dangerous" He's a pretty reasonable guy with above average intelligence and I had to simmer him down. I told him I would handle it when we got home - that I knew how the bicycling groups work around here. This is just to point out the kind of angry behavior this kind of thing could cause.

Other than that, it was a glorious morning to be out on those great roads on bicycles or motorcycles! We ended up going through backroads up near Dahlonega and cut through Suches and Blue Ridge etc. on hwy 60. The weather was perfect and the curves felt like slicing through butter! We encountered a few more groups of cyclists who quickly singled up when they heard us behind them. It helped restore the good mojo for the morning!

Good riding all!
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby ScottGreer » Tue Jun 18, 2013 9:52 am

I relate this to motorcyclist who run 100mph on I285 darting in and out of traffic. Then on rainy days drive the same way in their pickup that has a "Look twice Save a Life" bumper sticker. If we can't police ourselves only we are to blame when the mess hits the fan. I agree with Darwin. Tell yourself you are "in the right" if you like, but if you're being a dope on 2 wheels, the car wins every time :cheers:
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby DoctorJD » Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:08 am

LoneStar wrote:Ugh is all I can say. Cyclists can be our own worst enemies sometimes.

Yep. "Share the Road" works both ways.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby Mark D. » Tue Jun 18, 2013 11:29 am

DoctorJD wrote:
LoneStar wrote:Ugh is all I can say. Cyclists can be our own worst enemies sometimes.

Yep. "Share the Road" works both ways.


Yep. Road cyclist would be surprised at how far a tiny bit of courtesy will go. If you see you're backing up traffic then at least try and make it where the motor vehicle can pass safely. 9 times out of 10 there is a way to make that happen. I've seen groups do the exact same thing mentioned here, and could totally care less they were backing up traffic.Makes us all look bad.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby Mark D. » Tue Jun 18, 2013 11:37 am

u1ockjustice wrote:
grog wrote:mm9 - well said, thanks for the post . . .

trhoppe, while Mark was rather direct, his point stands that, essentially, 2 wrongs don't make a right. Just like there are times to use common sense when riding a posted "Open" trail after a heavy rain, common sense should stand that despite legally being allowed to ride 2 wide or take a lane when feeling unsafe, there are times when the line should stream out. And while it's been a while since I've been on that road and could be completely wrong, the vast majority of it I seem to remember being "safe" to ride on without taking the lane. Point is - yes, I've taken the lane, usually on blind curves where I don't want someone trying to pass me only to find themselves facing an oncoming car. I can't think of a time I've done it on a straightaway which the majority of that road is (again, if I remember right).

I'm going to get flamed for this but in the interest of full disclosure, I wasn't overly keen on the 3 foot law - at least not in addition to the current 2 abreast law. Honest feeling is that it should be one or the other but not both. Get 2 abreast then add the 3 foot and that's the whole lane . . . just my opinion, though.

I respect your opinion, just disagree with it. The reality is that I abhor these debates - especially amongst ourselves - as they do nothing but give the anti-biker crowd more fodder to rally behind. Are they going to look at my post and say "wow - what a reasonable response?" or your's and say "see? those damn bikers are selfish and only think about their own kind"?


if it makes you feel better, i don't think very many people at all see any of the posts on this forum.


It only takes one...............................
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby u1ockjustice » Tue Jun 18, 2013 7:54 pm

Mark D. wrote:
It only takes one...............................



true. and for the (non-existent) record, i completely agree with the general sentiment here. a little courtesy goes a long ways, and the driver you piss off is likely to take it out on the next guy on two wheels he comes across.
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Re: Concerns - Past Sunday's Group Ride - hwy372

Postby clem » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:03 pm

Not being there, I'd look just as hard at the first driver, who by refusing to pass was holding up everyone behind him, as I would at the cyclists.
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